damn..i can't believe the moderators of this board...looks like they don't have anything else to do...everything i post something they delete it....i tought i read:

quote:
Here's the spot for you to unwind and discuss anything and everything under the sun. Well, maybe not anything. Talk about Warez, and other illegal activities is still not permitted. Other than that, feel free to talk about daily events, that new joke you just heard, or nearly anything else you can think of. Enjoy!

before i entered this forum....well i'm not talking about warez or anything illegal...i'm just talking about a message board, it has a warez forum, but that's not illegal, nothing in it is..so here's the link again:

edit by MrMan: deleted

The FTP Server that's linked on the front page of that site contains many illegal warez, MP3s, DVDs.

The moderators are acting in all of our interests. They are highly respected for their knowledge and expertise and are supported by an overwhelming majority of the membership. They have an obligation to see to it that nothing illegal or inflamatory occurs here. Hope this helps you to understand this forum a little bit better.


Norm

Norm

Yeh, I guess we just don't want to be advertising those places, It's not a part of my computing experience.

Still I have noticed from reading through the forums, of people telling others to "Use their friends copy of windows to reinstall"

Those should be deleted too as that is very illegal

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

I've never seen that anywhere in these forums. Would you provide a link to such an instance, please?

Okkkkk

Looks like im going searching again :\

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Looks like Fernan doesn't have anything else better to do, eh?

Gravity....not just a good idea, it's the law!
My Magic

One thing I can promise you, if you continue to post links to sites offering pirated software you won't be allowed here at all. Consider this a final warning.

Shelly

And Shelly ain't kidding. Such postings threaten the existance of this site and they simply won't be tolerated. Most people eventually catch a clue, but those who don't, well..... there have been the very few who didn't.

One thing to realize here is that this is a long-lived community that has only recently landed at it's 3rd address. A huge chunk of us know each other from way back when, and we are determined to have a home that we all can come to. And Shelly was a major force in keeping us together this time around.

JP

Its always a touchy subject the warez topic.

With people having high Bandwith so easily its easier for them to grab more warez and not pay.

Sure the kids might think it cool now, but wait till big Corps say to hell with the PC market, were going console, then where are they gonna get their games?

Purchase games and apps, the developers deserve it for the time and effort they put into it to entertain you people who are stealing from their pockets. How would you all like me to take some cash out your bank account? What? Not fair, rude? Well that is exactly what your doing to these people who are trying to make a living to pay bills.

But I must stress, I havent seen this forum come down heavy on MP3's those are illegal also and they are just doing as much harm to the music industry as warez is to the software.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

I have PLENTY of mp3's that are legal.WALDO

Walter A Robertson

True DABhand, about the MP3's. But, I always try to look on the positive side of things. So hopefully this will bring the prices down to *normal*. For the music cd's that is. I mean the 331/3 records weren't expensive as cd's, were they? Sure new technology, but that doesn't mean more expensive.

Gravity....not just a good idea, it's the law!
My Magic

MP3's are not illegal, it is just a type of file like JGP, AVI, EXE, BMP, etc. What is frowned upon is the free trading of music in the MP3 format. If for example, you were trading for free, copy written photos in the JPG format, it would be just as wrong.

MSU

>Its always a touchy subject the warez topic.
>
>With people having high Bandwith so easily its easier for
>them to grab more warez and not pay.
>
>Sure the kids might think it cool now, but wait till big
>Corps say to hell with the PC market, were going console,
>then where are they gonna get their games?


From the same places they get their PC games. Dreamcast and Xbox games are offered via warez distributors (Class, FLT, Deviance, etc.)


>
>Purchase games and apps, the developers deserve it for the
>time and effort they put into it to entertain you people who
>are stealing from their pockets. How would you all like me
>to take some cash out your bank account? What? Not fair,
>rude? Well that is exactly what your doing to these people
>who are trying to make a living to pay bills.
>
>But I must stress, I havent seen this forum come down heavy
>on MP3's those are illegal also and they are just doing as
>much harm to the music industry as warez is to the software.

MP3's in and of themselves are not and will never be illegal (or unethical for that matter). Its the way in which some choose to get them. When MP3s first became really popular (i.e., when Napster was still running) there was a huge increase in CD sales. Now that it is getting harder for people to steal music, CD sales are off. The same is happening with games. If people can try them out, and they like them, they WILL go out and buy the game, mostly so they can get updates and patches, and to play online (i.e., Need for Speed Hot Pursuit 2, Battlefield 1942, UT2K3, etc.).

Heck don't give him a warning Shelley, ban him. He knows the rules.

Guns don't kill people. Husbands who come home early kill people.

Ok so they are not illegal.

Lets say Britney Spears releases a new single tomorrow, its a cool song.

Millions of people including some people here download the mp3, they have deprived her of single sales, then you have albums people will download an entire album and burn, again depriving sales, and it doesnt help much either when you have mp3 players, people will sit and listen to 15-20 albums (maybe new) on the player.

So tell why are they considered legal when in the long run, mp3s is to audio cd's as warez is to the software market. Neither is being bought. So surely thats illegal?

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Pirating music is illegal. MP3s don't have to be pirated music. I can "rip" MP3s from my CDs all I want, and they aren't pirated, they are completely legal. Matter of fact, I have a very large number of MP3s on my notebook that were created exactly that way.

Thats cool as you have bought the cd's so no loss of sales, im talking about people downloading from websites and p2p progs. They dont legally own the music and in a way are depriving the music market.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

That isn't MP3s, that is pirated music some in the form of MP3s. Just as Warez is pirated software, some in the form of executables. Shall we call executables illegal?

That isnt mp3s?

Your saying downloading an mp3 from Kazaa and extracting a song from a cd to HD arent the same thing. In both cases in the end both are MP3's. But your way is legal as your entitled to do that as such, as you rightfully purchased the music.

Warez isnt just little exe's like your trying to say, its programs that is given out to endusers for a price of 0, so yes mp3's are incorporated into the warez scene.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

You are claiming the form of the software is illegal. It isn't. The manner in which it is acquired is illegal. The word "Warez" specifically refers to illegally acquired software. "MP3" refers to a format, not to how the the music was acquired.

The economic model of the record business is entirely different than the software business. There's nothing to compare. You're right that it's stealing in either case, but so's robbing a liquor store, and that's got nothing to do with it either.

It is very similar in their ways.

In the end no cash flow no paychecks
no paychecks no people working
Unemployment rises a bit.

I suppose it hurts the software market more as games in particular are a big revenue for most companies and thats what keeps them afloat.

In a way its similar for the music industry, David Bowie once did a report on the influence of mp3's, he was against Napster but he knew taking it down would just encourage more similar p2p (which in the end did happen), he said with the time he did the report starting from when the mp3 codec started and mp3 music (although not as good quality back then) his sales/royalties droped by 60%. Man 60% is quite alot. Even for Bowie that would be massive, now imagine if Michael Jackson was in his prime just now, imagine that 60% on him. I dont think he would have all that nice plastic surgery etc lol

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

DABhand,

You need to step back and go learn what you are talking about.

And what makes you such an expert?

I see the flames have come already.

I used to be a cracker for one of the groups in amiga/mid PC times.

I could take anyone of you here and teach you how to remove protections etc if I wanted to.

But Im against warez now, ive seen how it can damage people and the small business.

So please take a step back and learn something yourself.

And mods take note, I am against warez as u can see in my posts, im an example of what i was back then when it was all "woooo super great amazing" now its "This is terrible why did i do it".

So please dont delete the thread.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Other than having created intellectual property and won copyright lawsuits, I also hold a degree in linguistics, and what you are discussing is language, not actions. Like I said, take a step back and learn what you are talking about.

I suggest a new career for you then.

Removing CD checks etc isnt illegal, but distrubting the program without the protections is. And I used to do that, before I changed. So in all fairness I know how the warez machine works.

And its all getting out of hand.

It was all rips at one point for games, people would download and play them, and they did eventually buy the game for the missing video and music and speech etc.

But with highspeed connections readily available and the introduction of CD Images, the warez scene will eventually destroy the industry and that is why I stopped as I dont want to be a reason on why so many people lose out in their hard earned cash.

Gladly Sony is working on ways of making it more and more difficult to encourage warez, their Securom Protection is getting better and better, it will eventually annoy the crackers and warez groups so much they will stop bothering with Securom protected software, its a shame the other software companies dont follow suit and use this protection, yes its not 100% just now, but its getting there.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Are you always this disjointed?

Man this forum is a great source of amusement, here I am trying to promote NOT using warez, and im being flamed as if I was promoting to use it. What fun.

Listen Ali its great your against warez etc in such a way.

Because you wont those cases does not mean you know 100% what warez is. I on the other hand was a part of it and know the system very well, way back in 1988 to 1998, 10 years of it. I do know what goes on and ive seen the effect it has on others, and in 1998 I took a step back had a look and said this aint right its way out of control. And stopped, now I try to get others to see what they are doing is very wrong and it causes unemployment, etc.

But if you wish to flame away ali go right ahead.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Oh and will the few people who are begging to me in PM please stop as I will NOT teach you to remove protections Thank you. :\

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Maybe you haven't noticed, but the policy of this forum is against piracy of any sort. You are the one who claimed that MP3s were such. They are not necessarily. What do you need, a diagram? A lesson in basic English?

And your the one who suggested I was talking about people like you who extract music from CDs when I didnt, From start im refering to people who downloads it and burns it to cd, so they dont purchase it. But you went ahead and thought I was talking about ALL mp3 users.

It would be good if other people here would read ALL of what is posted by a person, that way no misunderstandings are present. I know its hard with the forum as its sometimes a bit complicated knowing what post goes where.

But im not against anyone here, we all have a freedom of speech, but sometimes misunderstandings start all these unnecesary flame wars.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

Reread your posts. Or take a class in English comprehension.

hmmmmmmmmmmmm still you wanna carry on with your flaming, and your supposed to be a moderator here, not very professional behaviour is it?

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

DABhand,

I think you stepped into a defensive mode too quickly and you've not been able to see what Al actually said early on in this thread.

Your statements suggest that all MP3 files are illegal. That simply is not true. MP3 files obtained on a warez site are illegal. MP3 files copied from a CD that you don't have ownership of is illegal. However, a file being in the MP3 format is not what makes it illegal.

I suspect that you might agree but once your adrenalin level went up you lost your objectivity. Take a couple deep breaths and read the early posts in this thread once more. You might find that your actual position is pretty close to Al's.

This is getting out of hand. You are both correct. What Al is saying is that an MP3 is not necessarily illegal. Copies of performances a person already owns is legal under fair use, and do not become illegal because they are in the MP3 format. Also performances in the public domain are legal to download and use.

DABhand is perfectly correct in saying that downloading copyrighted music to use without paying royalties is stealing and illegal, but even this can become a bit murky. If you buy the so called "music CD-R's to record the downloaded music on, you are paying a premium in the price of the blank disks that goes to a royalty fund for paying for the right to use the downloaded material.

So determining exactly what is legal, and what is not can be confusing. One can not make a blanket statement that all downloaded music, in any form is inherently illegal. Therefore, we as moderators, must give people the benefit of the doubt, and judge the legality of a post on this subject according to the evidence available, and not assume that any such post is always about illegal activity.

Shelly

Thanks shelly some common sense at last

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

>Thanks shelly some common sense at last

That's why I like this forum: a policy of common sense and a honesty

Louis

Daband,
you got no clue what the f*** you're talking about...go to school!!

Oh grant us your shining wisdom oh guru of codecs.

DABhand woz ere ___oOOo_°¿°_oOOo___

When I was a little kid many years ago, I used to tape songs off the radio or from an album onto a casette, and made tapes for some of my friends. Then along came cassette players that had two decks, so it was easy to copy one caasette many times and hand em out for free.
I should have been busted, eh?

What you were doing was in fact just as illegal then as it is today.WALDO

Walter A Robertson

I should have been busted, eh?

Three separate "crimes" committed with your simple transgression:

1. Unauthorized copying of copyrighted material. (Believe it or not, even if it is your "right" to listen to it live, the copying of it denies the owner the option of revenue associated with having you listen to it a second time, and a third time, etc.)

2. Making them for your friends, i.e. distribution of copyrighted material.

3. Copying them to a tape, i.e. unauthorized duplication of copyrighted material.

You got away with a lot back then.

Dave

Dell 8300 Dimension
Pentium 4
W XP Home


www.woodenpropeller.com

Jesus, man, I was only a KID!!! oh boo hoo boo hoo boo hoo

That's why they let you off so easy.

Dave

Dell 8300 Dimension
Pentium 4
W XP Home


www.woodenpropeller.com

And I bet I wasn't the only person doing this. Where was the RIAA then? But remember too, there was about 150 million less people in the USA in them thar years.

Funny, The BIG record companies are complaining that cd sales have plummeted. They are attributing it solely to "pirated" software.

Could it be, perhaps, that the music of the last 5 years is just shit, and not worth buying? Could that be why sales have plummeted.

Course, being a few months shy of 40 (not a freakin' word people!), most new music is shit, to me.

MY HOME PAGE!

http://daterminehtor.blogspot.com/

I'm with you Daterminehtor. What with these 'teeny-bop' groups popping up, just like the pop-up windows. Annoying. I was born in '60, so I totally agree.
Back to the copying things off the radio, I did it too.
And, after the vcr became popular, the govt. change some laws to allow people to copy copyrighted material, IE: NFL, movies, shows, etc. Maybe they will change for the times?

Gravity....not just a good idea, it's the law!
My Magic

If it sounds like sh*t to you,can you imagine what it sounds like to someone born in the 30's. (Arghhhh There I go dating myself again.)

>They are attributing it solely to
>"pirated" software.

The RIAA did not place 100% of the blame on MP3 piracy. They said it was a major factor in the decline of CD sales, which is indisputable. Perhaps you should take a look at RIAA's consumer trend report for the year 2000:
http://www.riaa.org/pdf/2000_Consumer_Profile3.pdf

>Could it be, perhaps, that the music of the last 5 years is
>just shit, and not worth buying? Could that be why
>sales have plummeted.

Err, no. Maybe with popular music and rock (I wouldn't know since I don't listen to either), but as far as classical goes there are fantastic recordings being made by RIAA members such as Sony Classics, EMI, BMG Classics, and several others. To make a blanket statement that every single piece of music recorded in the last five years is shit is very naive on your part.

>Course, being a few months shy of 40 (not a freakin' word
>people!), most new music is shit, to me.

I only listen to classical music, and I'm 16 years old. There's little correlation between music taste and age.

I like Brittany Spears.

Guns don't kill people. Husbands who come home early kill people.

She's a hotty and I got plenty of pics of her too. }>

Stranger than life

I won't be able to sleep tonight until HAL9000 weighs in on this.I am sure this is some kind of goverment plot, but I won't really know the probable outcome until he sets it out.I think it may have something to do with China playing MP3s on both ends of the Panama Canal ( or something as momentous)HELP!

81 Newbee

Our Local cable co. has in the past offered to help the consumer set up two vcr's to copy tapes.

I guess they don't think it is wrong, huh?

Bill K.

>I only listen to classical music, and I'm 16 years old.
>There's little correlation between music taste and age.


I beg to differ.How many 16 year-olds listen to classical music?

I did, but I agree that it is unusual. Most youth are more interested in conformity within their peer group. Rational thought seldom appears in those under 20.

Shelly

>Err, no. Maybe with popular music and rock (I wouldn't know
>since I don't listen to either), but as far as classical
>goes there are fantastic recordings being made by RIAA
>members such as Sony Classics, EMI, BMG Classics, and
>several others. To make a blanket statement that every
>single piece of music recorded in the last five years is
>shit is very naive on your part.

>I only listen to classical music, and I'm 16 years old.
>There's little correlation between music taste and age.


Hey, well, there is a correlation between music and age. I too listen to classical, and jazz, and Dwight.

Course, I prefere Floyd, Zappa, Sabbath, Young, etc...

However, I do not listen to the radio any longer. Why? Because the music sucks! A song here, and song there makes not an album! i listen to by local jazz station, and my local sports station (which fortunately just happens to be one of the hightest rated on the continent FAN590!!!).

IMHO...don't comment on that one Grog... The Buggles were right. No video, no contract! Sheesh, why must one have a video to sell music? You don't see music, you feel it!

Drop the videos, see who makes music then. I bet there are a lot of good new bands out there that are not getting a chance because they can't come up with a video, sad.

Like Coldplay, which I just heard yesterday in my local HMV. They sound awesome! I have to buy one of their cd's. (doh, I was there, why didn't I then!? Well, off there again today, gotta buy Spidey!




MY HOME PAGE!

http://daterminehtor.blogspot.com/

You don't see music, you feel it!

Boy, isn't that the truth. I can't recall having ever bought a CD that had more than 3 good songs on it.

You can't lose with Jazz or Classical--both stand the test of time.

Damn!!!!HAL9000 weighed in and no facts(?) about a goverment plot or imformation about the WTO sabotaging the music industry.I am disapointed.Woe is me

81 Newbee

Did the mighty Record Industry Survive copying tapes? They were threatening the end of the earth when tape decks came out.

Did the mighty Record Industry Survive copying with digital tapes? They were threating the end of the earth when digital recording came out.

Did the mighty Record Industry Survive CD copying? They were threating the end of the earth when CD copying came out.

Did the might Record Industry Survive when MP3's came out? They took down a site where you could send your CD to store.

Did the mighty Record Industry Survive Napster and other PtoP transfers? When the economy was great, record sales flourished. When the economy gets good again, it will flourish again.

Artist, like David Bowie, get hot and then cold with or without Napster. Personally, I would not waste my time to copy one of his tunes. on any of the revenue stealing modes.

I think what the recording artist should look at is the Recording Industry Itself. I know of no other retailer in the World who gives the producer so little return on his product.

Now I can go out in the backyard and grow cows, but you can bet your ass they will not taste like the Iowa Beef Packers corn fattened beef.

AND I can produce, record, and distribute a record without Sony having to go into convulsions.

Where the industry has trouble is in finding talent to exploit and all this is just smoke screen to get dumb guitar players to sign up.