hi folks. I've decided for the first time to reinstall win98 on our old comp. weve had it 4 years without ever cleaning the slate and i thought i'd start the new year fresh. my problem is i've never partitioned or formatted or anything like that. I'm pretty uptight about it but I'm going to try. I've read the pc911 article and i must confess I'm alittle confused. we dont have anything to back up on it and I have the win98cd and all the drivers for it. I have everything laid out on the table now. I have 2 floppies. 1 says cdrom driver for dos and the other says nothing. this is where I'm stuck. when I boot with a floppy, do I insert it then turn on the machine? I cant tell if I have a startup disk or not.I have a screen with some basic stuff about the machine with an error disk or something like that at the bottom and a blinking line. I feel kinda stupid. I've been here since 2000 and I cant do this.

You might not have a startup disk. You can download one from http://www.bootdisk.com and use that. The first thing to do with that new bootdisk is to boot from it and make sure that you can access the CDROM drive. Once you are sure that you can do that, you can go about reformatting and reinstalling Windows.

thanks jp. just how do I access or see if i can access the cdrom drive?

what will I see if I have a startup disk or a proper startup disk?

Hi,

Back up any critical data you do not have stored on another media source.

Run the downloaded file from http://www.bootdisk.com to create the WIn 98 bootable floppy disk drive.

Boot the computer with this disk in the A: drive. This should take you through a message about starting the computer with CD support or without. Choose with.

Now try and access the Win 98 CD in the CD ROM drive. The CD ROM drive letter could be anything from D: to F: it may not be the same as in your normal use of the computer.

You may need to alter the Boot order in BIOS to do this.

Best order is

A:floppy
CD ROM
HARD DISK

then other drives

Save the settings if necessary and reboot with the floppy disk in the A: drive.

Once you get to an A: prompt

Type FDISK say yes to the question re large disk support.

Delete all existing partitions, then create new ones

Exit FDISK

Now format each partition.

FORMAT C: then any other partitions you have created.

Now select the CD by D: or E: with the Win 98 CD in place.

Then type SETUP.

Follow on screen wizard.

thanks ceri, but I'm still confused about the bootdisk.com link. do I download it and run it on the comp i'm working or do i put it on a floppy. i dont know whats on this floppy and whether its important. I'm really confused. I'll have to stop before i lose my temper. thanks anyway

>thanks ceri, but I'm still confused about the bootdisk.com
>link. do I download it and run it on the comp i'm working or
>do i put it on a floppy. i dont know whats on this floppy and
>whether its important. I'm really confused. I'll have to stop
>before i lose my temper. thanks anyway

Sonny,
You download the file for the Windows 98 or Windows 98 second edition (whichever you're using) at bootdisk.com

do it on the working computer you are using now.

then put a formatted floppy in the A drive and double click the file you downloaded and it will extract the files you need to the blank floppy in the drive. Then you boot the computer you're going to format with that floppy and follow Ceri's instructions

You can also make a proper bootup diskette within Win98 itself. If you bootup to Win98 normally - there's a tool where you can insert a blank floppy and Win98 will create it for you. It's been such a long time since i've done this, I've actually forgotten the exact steps. I'm sure I can find it on the MS Knowledge Base site.

EDIT:
I found the article, read the 2nd method if you haven't formatted your hard drive yet. Very simple.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/187632/EN-US/

Chewy is quite right.
There are two ways to do it. I prefer method no. 1 as it creates a bootdisk with no ram drive (less confusing as it does not change your CDRom drive letter designation)

Method 1
1. Place the Windows 98 CD-ROM in your CD-ROM drive, and have a floppy disk available.
2. Click Start, point to Programs, and then click Windows Explorer.
3. Open the following folder on the Windows 98 CD-ROM:
Tools\Mtsutil\Fat32ebd
4. Double-click the following file, and then follow the instructions to create the Startup disk:
Fat32ebd.exe
5. Write protect the floppy disk.

Method 2 (Standard Windows 98 Startup Disk)
1. Click Start, point to Settings, and then click Control Panel.
2. Double-click Add/Remove Programs.
3. On the Startup Disk tab, click Create Disk.
4. Follow the instructions on the screen.

Forget about Bootdisk.com. Since your computer still boots, you can make a boot disk from within Windows. Go to control Panel/Add Remove Programs, and click on the Startup Disk tab. Insert a Floppy disk and click on Create Disk.

There is no need to use fdisk unless you want to change the partition size or number you have now. Just format the drive by inserting the Startup disk and booting the computer. At the A: prompt type format c:\, you will be warned the all data will be lost, select yes and press enter, the format will proceed. Do the same with any other partitions you have. Your disk is now clean and formatted.

To install W98, boot again with the startup floppy select CD ROM Support when asked. At the A: prompt, insert the Windows CD and type D:\setup, where D is the letter of your CD drive. It will be one letter higher in the alphabet than it normally is.

Make sure you have the W98 disk key code before you start. you will need to enter it during the installation, if your W98 is an upgrade version you will also need a disk from an earlier version of windows for proof of ownership at some point during the process.

Shelly

I was wondering about the bootdisk.com stuff when his computer was still functioning myself.Shelly's suggestion is the easiest.

ok. the problem was the floppy my brother sent 4 years ago was not a win98 startup disk. I made one from the control panel, but as Shelly suggested(I'm not changing anything about the size. theres only 1 partition), I get the 3 options menu about cdrom support and non support and something else witha clock ticking the seconds when I boot with the startup disk. It is my understanding that I need to format the drive then I should recieve the 3 options menu?

>ok. the problem was the floppy my brother sent 4 years ago
>was not a win98 startup disk. I made one from the control
>panel, but as Shelly suggested(I'm not changing anything about
>the size. theres only 1 partition), I get the 3 options menu
>about cdrom support and non support and something else witha
>clock ticking the seconds when I boot with the startup disk.
>It is my understanding that I need to format the drive then I
>should recieve the 3 options menu?

like Shelly mentioned above:

boot with the floppy and select 'Start computer Without CDRom Support'

then at the A:\>you type format C:

A:\>format C: (enter)

After completing the format reboot and select 'Start Computer with CDRom Support'
then follow Shelly's instructions to Run setup from the Win98 directory on the Windows CD.

At the A: prompt, insert the Windows CD and type D:\setup, where D is the letter of your CD drive. It will be one letter higher in the alphabet than it normally is.

Ok folks. heres where I'm at. After screwing around all day I finally got a startup disk made and followed Shelly's advice. I got the c: formated and got to d:setup and went into setup.( I kept using the backslash and it wouldnt work. then I left the backslash out and it worked. took half a day to figure that out). I'm in set up and scandisk starts scanning the surface of the hdd and while half way thru the long process, I start getting a "bad sectors" box and I cant fix it and setup want continue. I'm really up the creek on this. Also it mentioned something about LBA which I dont understand. What do I do now? Is this where I have to zero-write the hdd or something like that? I'm using alot of profanity now. glad you all cant hear me.

I think the warning also said something about a bad cluster, if that will help.

If you have bad sectors & or a bad cluster on your disk, & if SCANDISK cannot fix it, then you should download a disk diagnostic from your HD manufacturer. If that finds problems that it cannot fix, then it is probably time to replace your HD.

thank you rube. i'll remember that.

>I kept using the backslash and it wouldnt work. then I left
>the backslash out and it worked. took half a day to figure
>that out).

You wouldn't have had that problem if you had followed the directions I posted in reference to the MSKB article. See reply #7. Shelly is usually right, he just made a typo in using the backslash.

>I'm in set up and scandisk starts scanning the
>surface of the hdd and while half way thru the long process, I
>start getting a "bad sectors" box and I cant fix it and setup
>want continue.

Normally, windows will continue the setup by ignoring the bad clusters but then again, if there are too many, .... Windows setup will stop.

>I'm really up the creek on this. Also it
>mentioned something about LBA which I dont understand. What do
>I do now?

LBA - stands for Large Block Address. This allows for drives larger than 504 MB to be fully partitioned using FDISK. If you get a prompt asking you to enable it - type 'Y' for yes and press Enter.

should of read your link chewy. i'm going to try it again with setup in the morning and see if it will fix itself or something. it did mention the lba and the bios(which is another place i'm not familiar with) so i went there and fumbled around bit didnt see anything. I took a perfectly good computer today and royally screwed it up

If you are getting bad sectors, maybe it wasn't a perfectly good computer. At $1.00 a Gig. new faster hard drives are very affordable. if a "0" write doesn't fix things, that may be the way to go, and you can use it for extra storage in your next computer. Bad hardware can make a first attempt a nightmare, and it seems you are near that point now. Just a thought from someone who has been there a time or two, or three or four.

thanks grey. should have left well enough alone. i thought i saved a everest report in my briefcase, but it was the wrong puter. now if i nrrd the model number, I'll have to take it apart

hi again folks. wellits morning and ive tried already once to get scandisk to get past a bad sector with no luck. It wont fix it and I had to start again. The bad place is right in the middle so after 1 and a half hours I start again. when it gets there again I think I'll choose Skip and if that doesnt work I dont know what I'll do. Can someone point me to a zero write program and maybe a tutorial on how to use it?

I don't know that a zero write program is what you will need?

Try diagnostic from the manufacturer & see if they can map out the bad sector.

Finding a bad sector may be an indication that more are to come. So you'll want to keep an eye on it even if that works.

What a zero write might do (& I'm not sure of that) is possibly to hide the fact that there is something wrong - without fixing it, & if that is the case your just postponing the inevitable.

This of course threatens to lead to a snowballing chain of events.

1. I thought that most hard drives were able to map out and isolate bad sectors on their own. Or is that a function of the OS, or BIOS even?

2. I agree that a cheap, newer hard drive is an attractive avenue. (And so is a CD burner, if not a DVD burner...) But at current capacities, such a drive might or might not be read fully or properly, depending on the age of the motherboard, correct? How far would we have to go before finally deciding that a new motherboard, a new CPU, new RAM and possibly new OS (to take advantage of all this new gear) are on the shopping list?

Just honest questions. I've worked on enough old computers recently (other people's) that I often have to weigh pros and cons.

PC specs viewable here...
Folding@Home with Team PleasureDome!

thats what i've been worrying about mojo. its an old 6vba soyo board and it gos to 66ata. u cant find anything today below 100. also, i cant get scandisk to fix the bad sector. It shows up on the scan about 60% of scanning which leads to these questions: Can I partition half the hdd and use that good side to install win98, or does scandisk scan the whole disk no matter what. I f I find a diagnostic tool for this Western digital Spartan 136aa, how can I get a program bigger than 1.44mb(floppy) in the computer to run it?

Sonny,

Here is a diagnostic utility that you can use to check the drive and write zeros to it, but it sounds like you are flogging a dead horse.

http://support.wdc.com/download/index.asp?cxml=n&pid=5&swid=18

thanks mike. i appreciate it.

ok. I downloaded the diagostic tool that mike kindly offered let me see if I got this straight: I get another floppy. I put the new floppy in the xp machine and somehow I need to format that. then I take the file I downloaded from west. dig. and put it on the floppy. then I take the floppy and put it on the old machine and boot. I then have to type something to get it to run but I dont know how. I really feel stupid. Sorry

the file I downloaded is a zip file. do I unzip it in some folder and take the contents of that folder and somehow put it on a floppy?

You should not have downloaded to a floppy, you need to unzip it to a floppy. then run it form that floppy.

Shelly

No. I think you miss understand me Shelly. I downloaded the tool to my other machine. now I need to make a floppy on the working machine so I can take it to the one I'm working on. Am I correct in inseting a floppy into my good machine, choosing the zip file that I downloaded and unzipping it with Winzip to the floppy. Then I take the floppy from the good machine to the bad and boot with it. Shouldnt I have to type something to get the exe. to work?

Here are the instructions Sonny:

1. Download the DlgDiag28.zip.
2. Create a bootable floppy and extract the file onto it.
3. Boot to that floppy by making sure that your boot order is set to floppy first in your Bios.
4. Run the Dlgdiag.exe file.

In other words, at the A:\> you type dlgiag.exe (enter)


A:\>Dlgdiag.exe


5. You will see the following options:
* SELECT DRIVE AND VIEW STATUS- Always choose this option first, as it determines which drive you will be working on.
* QUICK TEST - This option tests your drive quickly for any major physical problems. (Please note: Although this option is safe and does not alter the data on your hard drive, Western Digital recommends that you have a current backup of your data).
* EXTENDED TEST - This option checks your drive thoroughly and it can repair any correctable errors. (Please note: Although this option is safe and does not alter the data on your hard drive, some data loss may occur, depending on the errors fopund and the rrors corrected. Western Digital recommends that you have a current backup of your data).
* WRITE ZEROS TO DRIVE - The Write Zeros option, wipes any and all data off your drive. This option used when your data is no longer usable or recoverable. If you no longer need any data from your drive and would like to start over, run this option to set your drive to an as new condition. NOTE: Please make sure that you have selected the correct drive to perform this function on as once ran, no data will be recoverable.
* VIEW TEST RESULTS - You can see the results of the test you just performed
* PRINT TEST RESULTS - Test results can be printed with this option. USB printers are not supported
* LOG FILE OPEN/CLOSE - You can access the log file which is generated automatically
* ENTER AND PRINT RMA INFORMATION - Information pertaining to each drive tested can be customized and printed with this option.
* QUIT - Reboot your system once you have completed the selected tasks
6. Select the task you wish to perform.

What I would do is create a boot disk from control panel on your good machine:

Method 2 (Standard Windows 98 Startup Disk)
1. Click Start, point to Settings, and then click Control Panel.
2. Double-click Add/Remove Programs.
3. On the Startup Disk tab, click Create Disk.
4. Follow the instructions on the screen.

Now you have a disk that you know will boot the computer.
extract (unzip) the files to that floppy.

ok mike thanks and I'll give it a try.

Sonny,
I just noticed that your good machine is running Windows XP, so you won't be able to make that floppy the way I described. You will need to put your Windows 98 CD in the good machine and do it this way:

1. Place the Windows 98 CD-ROM in your CD-ROM drive, and have a floppy disk available.
2. Click Start, point to Programs, and then click Windows Explorer.
3. Open the following folder on the Windows 98 CD-ROM:
Tools\Mtsutil\Fat32ebd
4. Double-click the following file, and then follow the instructions to create the Startup disk:
Fat32ebd.exe

I already have a Win98 startup disk made.

Ok. I better go out and get a blank floppy since I dont have another one to spare. I really appreciate everyones help.

how do I format the floppy with the /s switch?

On method 2 mike, my good machine has Winxp not Win98se, but I did make a Win98 startup disk before I started. Are you saying that I can go ahead and extract the tool on the startup disk?

yes, I would do it that way, as you need a bootable disk. I'm not sure that the files you extract will put system files on the floppy.

If the floppy won't hold them all post back

You really dont need a startup disk. Just format a blank floppy disk with the /s switch. It will boot to an A: prompt and have a lot more room on it to unzip the file to.

Shelly

how do I format the floppy with the /s switch?

Sonny,
just put the floppy in the drive and double click 'My Computer'
then right click your A drive and select 'Format'

then put a check in the box to 'Create MSDos boot disk.

that will give you a bootable floppy with a bit more free space as Shelly suggested, although I ran those files onto a standard 98se boot disk and they fit OK.

Thanks Mike for that last suggestion. That was a real helper. Ok, I ran Lifeguard and used the extensive scan and of course it found no errors. So to be sure, one more time, I tried to get scandisk to go all the way thru and it stop at 58%. Still one little red square out of that whole screen that represents the hdd. I still get the LBA screen and something about the partition. I think tomorrow I'll go into the bios and see if I can find the LBA and see if its enabled. I wonder if loading the defaults might help? If that doesnt help I guess I'll use Lifeguard to zero write the hdd. Which leads me to this question: If I zero write will I have to partition and format the hdd?

>If I zero write will I have to partition and format
>the hdd?

Yup

thanks 666man. thats what i thought. I'll learn another lesson tomorrow. luckily, a few years ago, i printed out the instructions from pc911(thanks al) and have them on hand. wish me luck

Sonny
everything you need is here in the tutorial by our own Grogan.

Take your time. If you screw up just delete everything and start over till you get it the way you want it.

If you cannot complete a format of the partition after the zero write then you know you need a new hard drive..

http://www.pcnineoneone.com/howto/clean1.html

ok mike thanks and I'll post back with the results

is it safe to assume that after I zero write the drive, I wont have to delete any partitions because everything will be wiped out?

Yes

Ok folks, after much weeping and nashing of teeth, I zero wrote the hdd and I finally learned to partition and format c: I finally got Windows Setup to start, but after 11% of copying the files I get a "cab file error" box and I cant get it any farther. Any suggestions?

Try this link
AGB

http://search.microsoft.com/search/results.aspx?View=en-ca&p=1&c=10&st=b&qu=cab+files&na=32&cm=512

Sonny,
taka a look at this:

CAUSE
This behavior can occur for any of the following reasons:
• Your CD-ROM drive is not functioning properly. The CD-ROM may vibrate too much for the laser to accurately read the data. With the higher spin rates of modern CD-ROM drives, slight damage to a CD-ROM can affect the CD-ROM drive's ability to read a CD-ROM properly.
• Your computer is over-clocked. Extracting files from the Windows 95/98 cabinet files is memory intensive. If your computer is over-clocked beyond the default settings, it can contribute to decoding errors. Computers that are not over-clocked but are having a cooling problem can also experience decoding errors.
• Your computer has bad or mismatched RAM or cache. For example, you are using EDO and non-EDO RAM, or you are using different RAM speeds. Even if Windows seems to be running without problems, the additional stress of extracting files and accessing the disk may contribute to decoding errors.
• Your computer has Bus Mastering or Ultra DMA enabled in the BIOS and in Device Manager. The data may be moving too quickly for the system to keep up.
• You are using a third-party memory manager.
• There is a virus on your computer.
• A plug and play device cannot be detected correctly.
• Your Windows 95/98 CD-ROM or disks are damaged.
• Your computer's CPU is overheating as a result of faulty CMOS settngs, a malfunctioning CPU fan, or improper heat dissipation. For example, the heat sink on the CPU is not correctly cooling the CPU.
• The internal or external cache on the processor or main board is going bad. This is most noticeable when Setup has this problem during file copy phase.
• You have Norton Autoprotect enabled.NOTE: If this is the case, clear the Norton Autoprotect check box in the Startup group item in Msconfig and contact Symantec about a fix.


You could try it another way:

Copy the cab files to your hard drive and run the setup from there and see if it will work.

format the C drive again

Put your Win98 CD in the drive

then boot your computer with the floppy, and select CDRom Support.

A:\>C: (enter)

C:\> md cabs (enter)

C:\>E: (enter) where E is your CDRom drive letter

E:\>cd Win98 (enter)

E:\Win98 copy *.* C:\cabs

You wait for a message that says 101 files copied.

then:

E:\>Win98 cd\ (enter)

E:\>C: (enter)

C:\>cd cabs (enter)

C:\cabs setup /ie (enter)


when prompted install to C:\WINDOWS

Thanks Mike

hi folks. I didnt want to leave this thread open without a solution. My brother sent my original Win 98se cd and the install went fine.

Way to go Sonny, glad to hear it...